Why does China, Germany, Japan, S Korea or even Europe try to export. Can you help me out of this mess?”. Investor-owned facilities are permitted to continue to operate within the system and budgetary controls that might restrain them were excluded from the bill. Since buying imports is how foreigners get currency to buy or exports, reducing the level of inputs bought reduce the amount of dollars in foreign hands, which necessarily means they can’t buy as many exports. Those are not more expensive than they were decades ago in constant dollars. Under HR 676, all people living in the U.S. would be included in the system, there would be free choice of health professional, the coverage would be comprehensive and care would be provided as needed without financial barriers. Health is connected to having an education, a job, a home, clean air and water and much more. I believe human beings have certain inherent characteristics that are observable, and predictable, and that will be displayed by each individual person as they interact with the world around them. . We discuss what it will take to win and how to proceed. When the founders said “We hold these truths to be self evident…” they weren’t literally claiming that they were self evident. Have you seen people glorifying that imports are plus and exports are minus to the economy. You are trying to blur the distinction between a person voluntarily paying for something they want, and being mugged. it’s only the definition of person that shifts. At the same time, support for a National Improved Medicare for All single payer health care system is increasing and there are bills in both the House and Senate with record numbers of co-sponsors. We also understand it is human nature for some people to arogantly believe that they know what is best for everyone, and that forcing otherwise peaceful people against their will is acceptable. Healthcare is not a commodity but a public good, and we want to see a strong commitment of government and IFIs alike to the implementation of the SDGs instead of pushing policies that deepen inequality and inequity. Of course there is a grey area over where you draw the line over how much services you provide, but as a principle, I think there are some things that community has to wear – and health is one of them. Study it. Oh, I know. The movement for National Improved Medicare for All has made great strides this year. We counter our opponents through the principals of I.C.U. Too bad for Jon. “It’s not the same service. I could also say something like this: “We hold this truth to be self evident: that gravity exists as a natural force in the known universe, and that it operates such that every object with the property of mass in the universe attracts every other object with mass as follows:”. “You just don’t see other species respecting rights and forming either representative governments or your beloved bowling leagues. of course, this lack of notice shall extend to defending you as well. However, if the internet service company charges me more than we agreed to, then it is stealing from me. Is it a tax, if it pays for services received? You probably didn’t ask to be prosecuted. But, then you have to because you can only make disparaging comments. There is nothing in our nature or God given, if you prefer, about a trial by a jury of our peers. I see being compelled to actually sit on a jury the same as a tax. Even Puck could see what fools these mortals be. As we waited for introductions, he whispered that I had “drawn the short straw.” Tito was more right than he could have imagined. Let me guess- people who draw the line at a point you don’t approve of are nasty. Angell … It also doesn’t address the monopoly issue of the provision of such services. I do not have a taxpayer subsidized job. But that’s also true of government-sponsored medical care, as the most honest advocates will admit. No. Such a concept wouldn’t necessarily exist if the state didn’t assume the authority to accuse people of crimes against itself, which may or may not have actual victims. It is always the case that we are each better off when we pay as low a price as possible for the things we want and need. “Trump knows this – that’s why I’m such a fan.”. but I could not in good conscience think people be refused basic health care because they were poor. HR 676 would create a publicly-financed not-for-profit health care system. You probably exchange (export) your labor for the things you want instead, like food, clothing shelter, etc. It is hypocritical to say you oppose taxes, except when you think the tax might benefit you. Let’s have a bit a conversation about this. Aristotle was wrong but he was not “disingenuous.” As for trying to justify American slavery, some sincerely believed the argument and some didn’t. I will respond later today. Since society doesn’t require us to be sedentary, eat unhealthfully or indulge in other behaviors hazardous to our health, I wouldn’t expect society to compel others to pay or provide medical services for us. Perhaps you can argue that taxes are paid voluntarily, but you know that’s not true. “In the past 48 hours, I see statements such as “taxation is theft” or “God strike me down if I must compromise on my principles”.”. (1) That health care is most efficiently distributed by a free market mechanism; and, (2) That medical services are an ordinary commodity. But this concept of a fair trial is a social construct that exists only because the state exists, and in cases of a jury trial, may require that someone be placed in the service of the defendent against their will. that seems like the pivotal distinction to me. A victory this year is that there are bills in the House and Senate that outline a National Improved Medicare for All health care system, and they have record numbers of co-sponsors. . Those and millions of other products that are “made by hand” haven’t increased in price in any measure of individual income including number of hours worked at average or median wage/hr. Aristotle made the natural rights argument for slavery. Your rights can be violated by individuals or the state. It’s time for a real health care revolution of, by and for the people! I believe in “fair” trade not “free” trade. We cannot attach this movement to any political party or politician’s agenda. No more, no less. So people should be free to trade as long as they’re satisfied it’s fair? Of course you DID use the word “unlawful”. Such privileges and civil rights shouldn’t be confused with our natural rights which exist independently of the existence of government. have concluded that funding new Arctic drilling is far too risky and bad for business.”. 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Emergent orders may or may not be beneficial for humans and are often some combination of the two. Market order emerges from no one being in charge. Who here is opposed to US manufacturing? Social interactions between two or more people may or may not include recognition of, and respect for these natiral instincts of the other party or parties, but I think that for the most part, people tend to seek agreement on mutually beneficial codes of conduct that provide the most benefits to themselves at the least cost, including voluntary trade, specialization, division of labor, and mutual defense. He tends to write that and other meaningless drivel when he has no actual argument. In addition we see many species acting cooperatively as a group to mutual advantage in hunting and in mutual defense. they also get it wrong. That’s true, but we were talking about jury trials, which have no basis in natural rights, but are only a convention offered by the state as protection against the state. Such arrogance! We need to make more with more, even better paid, employees. So why aren’t all jobs outsorced? Sign up for HOPE here. But yes, the hypocrisy can be a little stomach churning. We urge you to reconsider if you wish to be taken seriously. Jon, I think there is a difference. Livestreaming a video of an arrest where a police officer's use of force leads to his arrest. If you are interested in some really interesting thoughts on this matter, and since I know you don’t read much these days (ha) I would highly recommend “The Problem of Political Authority” by Michael Huemer if you haven’t already read it. If you are sick, you now have the right to demand that my wife, who is a doctor, care for you. Another major contributor to higher prices is the incessant meddling by government in the market for medical care and insurance. That is what the “progressives” said about Barry Obama. BTW, I will keep pointing our your hilarious mistakes. Because medical care is a commodity, and treating it otherwise is foolhardy. Because medical care is a commodity, and treating it otherwise is foolhardy. Practically, declaring medical care a right does not guarantee its provision. It will take preparation and hard work. yet we have had religious wars for millennia. Further complicating matters, the majority of healthcare … Yes, you do. The threat of getting badly mauled by a more capable lion may discourage theft of that lion’s dinner by another. How, exactly, can there be such a right without the government’s rationing care, using compulsion to force individuals to provide it, and confiscating mass sums of wealth to pay for it? They understand that some people don’tactually want the goods or services provided by monopoly government and don’t wish to pay for what they haven’t asked for, so they must be robbed in order to pay for those things. It is the primary source of funding for defense and many other programs. I believe the individual is sovereign, and the collective is merely the aggregate of all individual members, with no superior status of any kind. Government may use force against me if I refuse to pay. As John Locke said, the purpose of government is to secure and protect the God-given inalienable natural rights of the people. That could refer to natural law, common law, or statutory law. We are willing to fight for them and they are not really open for debate. C = Clarity – we must educate ourselves and others about basic health policy so that we understand what elements are required for the system to meet our goals and our needs. Ah, a “tell” for cognitive dissonance. Every individual has the natural right of liberty. Of course most human “representative governments” lack the consent of the governed, and therefore have no legitimate authority over non-members. Something has to be done to heal the rupture in the sickened body of our nation. Duh. We assumed you were referring to education and medical treatment as products made by hand. Yep. Same with everything, shift Hollywood out, shift all damn service industries. “We are willing to fight for them and they are not really open for debate.”. but the ones that let it stay up are always the same. Let me rephrase my question to be clearer: ram doesn’t know, but he’s sure Trump is going to help him. i could care less what you or the state thinks is “fair”. As I keep saying, I’m not against trade and I prefer lower tariffs to higher ones, but I am more interested in the art of what’s achievable. We created a chart comparing HR 676 and S 1804 and a chart outlining the transition for S 1804. The answer: There can’t be. “But yes, the hypocrisy can be a little stomach churning.”. I believe that, even in the absence of a state, judging people guilty of a crime and punishing them for that crime without a fair trial would be a violation of their rights. It is the same spirit that says, “You work and toil and earn bread, and I’ll eat it.” No matter in what shape it comes, whether from the mouth of a king who seeks to bestride the people of his own nation and live by the fruit of their labor, or from one race of men as an apology for enslaving another race, it is the same tyrannical principle.”. If Abraham Lincoln’s views were “impoverished,” then I am guilty as charged. “It’s clear that modern notions of liberty have only had currency for the last two centuries. Write CSS OR LESS and hit save. And, you can read the law and court decisions on the internet. Its strengths are that it endeavors to achieve a universal Medicare for All system with more comprehensive coverage than what most people have now. “On this point, the left are very good emotive language”. And I believe you would see a lot fewer fair trials under an-cap because there would be fewer sanctions against impulsive vigilante revenge and more cases where one side was paying those conducting the purportedly “fair” trial. defining what “a person” means does not really affect the rights structure that works. Your comment deserves more than a superficial response, and I have no time right now. The Aristotle’s argument is basically that those who may be enslaved are inferior and not fully human. I can find lawyer in india. the others make it wobblier. Hence, what if we propose let us close all Universities and ask the other nations to teach and we will pay. The slavers argued that a negro was property like a pig. That has been the property rights argument for slavery throughout history. American Enterprise Institute Even Breitbart kicked him out. In that case, why don’t we ship every damn service job including the poeple who comment here. It’s easy to be pro-trade when your jobs are not in question. If I buy internet service and later refuse to pay, the internet service company is justified in using force against me to get its money. To make a commodity cheaper and better, two elements are necessary: profit incentive and freedom of labor. Did your comment address choice? Also, take health spending as an investment. President-elect, you are wrong about tariffs. We decide we want something (a right to trial by jury) and then decide how to provide it (compulsory jury duty). Who wouldn’t? If you’re concerned with the expense, it makes sense to NOT treat chronic conditions until a patient is near death, and will then cost the least to treat. Would you claim the same things about plumbing, yard care, bricklaying or pizza making? Unfortunately, based on first impressions, it seems to be similarly ineffective on the “Make America Great Again” folks. No. It’s necessary to start from first principles that can’t be deduced from any other principle. According to these “experts”, isn’t it good to import everything be it goods or services. “Rather, they understand the necessity of taxes, but want a say in how those taxes are raised and spent. They may not know you’re interested. Things always change. Otherwise no threat of force would be necessary. The only thing you left out is the beneficial effects of market forces including competition. may not be able to achieve good health. That is the issue that will continue in this country when these poor tongues of Judge Douglas and myself shall be silent. The Canadian ”œsingle-payer” system eliminates these inefficiencies in one fell swoop, by creating a single manda- tory universal plan. They knew that those who said “you work and I will eat” would object to other people’s involuntary servitude. Main fax: 202.862.7177, © 2020 American Enterprise Institute |. Thus, the excess taxation plus the borrowing is theft. You would do much better if you used logic and objective and verifiable facts. There is nothing “magical” about this. Most of the folks here are against Trump policy of import tariffs and US manufacturing. It probably won’t work. Imagine my surprise that you still don’t have a valid argument against natural rights. Perhaps, you can get morgdiot to explain why the police should not use no-knock warrants to arrest violent felons again? It regulates how doctors deal with patients, the sorts of training doctors must undergo, and the sorts of insurance they must maintain; all of this convinces fewer Americans to become doctors. There will be a fight for importing. They are, especially when the amounts collected exceed the amounts necessary to perform legitimate government functions. *paste* Taking money from people under threat of force is always called theft. Taxation is theft. In the US we have a “right” to travel freely, which means the government won’t stop us from peacefully traveling. At a recent forum in Brewster, several highly qualified people discussed the future of health care in the United States, specifically the idea of a single-payer system. Many of them reveal great economic ignorance. I do believe that both markets and nation states represent good examples of emergent order. If you are not constantly improving your skills to enhance your value to your employer, then you are being very foolish. In terms of lions and their dinners, the most dominant lions tend to get what is sometimes referred to as “the lion’s share” regardless of how the weaker lions feel about it. Do you grow all the food you eat? Actually I don’t see a real difference between a gas tax and a toll. People may have a property right in any creature that is no human. Duh. natural rights may be enumerated by constitution, but this does not mean they can be made up out of thin are. A gas tax is always theft. And Jury nullification can work against the rights of the accused even more easily than it can work in their favor. Beyond that, there will still be a lot to do to make sure everyone has their health care needs met. Whether others choose to respect these “rights” depends for the most part on a determination by the potential violator of the personal cost of doing so. defense, police, and security fall into that category. Because medical care is a commodity, and treating it otherwise is foolhardy. 1 day earlier, in the womb, is it? Other countries will do the same in response and our ability to export goods will be reduced as well. Unfortunately, I probably won’t get to it until the summer, “If people wanted those things for which taxes are collected, they would pay for them voluntarily, and they wouldn’t be called taxes, and there would be no need for threats.”. it just included or excludes from it. You made stuff up then too. Jim Kavanaugh of The Polemicist argues that S 1804 may actually be a “Trojan Horse” for the Democrat’s favored proposal, a public insurance they refer to as a ‘public option’ being added to the current mix. President Obama’s ACA was written by and for the medical industrial complex to enrich the few, and he is already receiving hundreds of thousands of dollars for Wall Street speeches. I know you believe that some magical political order emerges from the state, just as order emerges from free markets, but I don’t see it. The government destroys both of these elements in the health-care industry. it’s possible to make a coherent natural rights argument for or against abortion. I think most commenters here agree with the concept of user pays, but many don’t believe one organization should have a monopoly on the provision of services and a monopoly on the use of force. And whereas government-sponsored medical care requires a top-down approach that violates individual liberties, generates overdemand, and quashes supply, markets prize individual liberties, reduce demand (you generally demand less of what you must pay for), and heighten supply through profit incentive. Jon, taxation is not theft when it is for legitimate government functions. In fact, I don’t think that merely arguing for things is what makes them true and I sure didn’t say that. “Their point was to say that these are our assumptions and values. In the past 48 hours, I see statements such as “taxation is theft” or “God strike me down if I must compromise on my principles”. That is not quite correct. Many “crimes” are statutory in nature, and have no basis in actual law, and judgements in these “crimes” may provide justice to no one at all. We know that our rights aren’t granted by government, but by God, or by our nature as human beings. Just let your company know what you are doing. Thanks for the laugh. Do you know what the argument for trade is? Absolutely. These guys are mercantilists of another era. You have already paid for the roads with your income, property, and sales taxes. So, why don’t they? it can just be exclusionary. Any person who says that health care is a right or basic necessity but supports keeping the existing market-based structure is either confused or lying. All humans will act to defend these rights instinctively. no court action. i would actually argue that the slavery thing goes the other way. In fact the US Constitution and Bill of Rights acknowledge a few of the innumerable rights individuals have, and in every case forbids government to interfere with them. I’d like to think that might work. “This suggests that you have been reading comments by Greg Webb.”. our current tax system is theft. It doesn’t happen. Is a gas tax, a taxed paid for by the users of the resource and not by those who don’t, theft? That is a Constitutional right that has been long held under English jurisprudence. if you do not pay your tax, nothing happens. Not to declare medical care a “right,” and certainly not to dismiss reliance on the market as perverse cruelty. “, but I’ll take the 75% on offer and the steal the rest later !”. morganovich- “this seems like a really slippery issue and an impossible standard.”. Sometimes taxes are a necessary part of civilisation. I’ll take the 75% on offer and the steal the rest later ! .’. Do you harvest the cotton you grow, process it and use it to make your clothes? No one is opposed to US manufacturing. . in your opinion, which is often incorrect. . Doesn’t the right to a trial and jury require a service provided by other people? Or reduce taxes. To have lasting success, this needs to be a multi-partisan effort on the movement’s terms. Extract from the Civil Society Report "Spotlight on Sustainable Development 2017" -the new global report assesses how privatization and corporate capture have become obstacles to progress under the 2030 Agenda. You have a right to a trial by a jury of your peers. Trump knows this – that’s why I’m such a fan. Mergers by health insurers, hospitals and pharmaceutical companies have been acts of desperation, as each sector fights for control. Another weakness is the exclusion of long-term care and keeping it in Medicaid, which forces people and their families to live in poverty to receive benefits. He’s quite the consummate thread hijacker. Rights are socially constructed. ociety prosecutes criminals, if society chooses to prosecute, it guarantees a right to defend yourself, including a trial by jury. Will the United States finally join the long list of countries that provide health care to everyone? fly? Health historian, David Barton Smith, writes (in a draft chapter) that the fundamental struggle in the U.S. has been over the question of whether health care is a commodity that belongs in a market or whether it is a basic necessity that requires the protection of government so that it is universal. there are rights upon which they can be based and those rights are subject to natural laws. Now on freeways you could do toll by plate as it is done in Miami, where a picture of your back license plate is taken and you get a monthly bill with a $2.50 service charge plus the tolls. I think our difference is in defining which, if any, “rights” are natural and what “rights” are social constructs – guarantees by the state against abuse by the state. Ostensibly, those people sitting on the jury are the same ones who are prosecuting you. "As economists," the letter reads, "we understand that universal, publicly financed health care is not only economically feasible but highly preferable to a fragmented market-based insurance system. “You’re welcome to your imaginary world, one which is inconsistent with human nature, and the history of civilization.”. but the basic rights are all the same. Yes, they were. The main arguments both in favor of and against slavery were both natural rights arguments for example. “He has turned Jon’s comment section into a wasteland where the overwhelming majority of the comments are Greg Webb in an excruciatingly predictable and insipid conversation with himself. “Of course there is a grey area over where you draw the line …”. It is much more highly skilled, requiring far more training. Since passage of the ACA, major health insurance company stock values have quadrupled. >—-“the fact that people made an argument for slavery and called it natural rights does not make that claim true.”. I’ve been laid off when my company relocated its manufacturing facility. But what they might consider to be doable won’t solve the health care crisis. There’s not necessarily anything wrong with that. It also protects against rights violations by individuals seeking vigilante justice. Pro 2 Instituting a right to health care could lower the cost of health care in the United States. That seems to be a pretty good argument, if you ask me. 2. But we have no such rights in relation to private property. Brick-laying and plumbing income has largely tracked median income, which had been growing until the last couple of decades. The costs of protecting and providing your rights goes hand in hand with the effort to prosecute you. As we continue to attempt to restructure how health care is measured, reimbursed and organized, we must hold true to the idea that health care is simply not a service commodity. Markets, e ciency, and health care. Like Obama promising to shut Gitmo “on day 1.” Or end our involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan. Yep. Please explain how the laws of supply and demand do not apply when the supply of buyers is restricted on the basis of race. Under HR 676, all people living in the U.S. would be included in the system, there would be free choice of health professional, the coverage would be comprehensive and care would be provided as needed without financial barriers. taxes collected from the unwilling by threat of violence are theft. It would truly treat health care as a public necessity and not a commodity. The examples we used, plumbing, brick walls and pizza are final products, and cost no more than they ever did. Jon is exposing basic economics. A criminal act in which property belonging to another is taken without that person’s consent.”, http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/theft, “In common usage, theft is the taking of another person’s property or services without that person’s permission or consent with the intent to deprive the rightful owner of it.”. It would truly treat health care as a public necessity and not a commodity. Thank you to all of you who wrote to his office. Efforts to create a national health insurance have existed in the United States for the past 100 years. but that’s no reason for us to emulate them.”. Taking money from people under threat of force is always called theft. Kevin Zeese is an American political activist who has been a leader in the drug policy reform and peace movements and in efforts to ensure a voter verified paper audit trail. Healthcare is not a commodity but a public good; Healthcare is not a commodity but a public good. A trial itself, of course is conducted by employees of the state, and an all voluntary jury would be fine, but conscription for that purpose is wrong. Abraham Lincoln famously pointed out why when he eloquently explained why people could not be property. Firms are always hiring younger, better educated people. Yes, I remember those horrible days prior to EMTALA when anyone who failed to carry proof of medical coverage with them at all times, was likely to be left to die, bleeding and unconscious, by the side of the road. Do you have the right to demand that the medical system provide life-saving care forever, to the tune of millions of dollars of other people’s taxpayer dollars or services? We meant actual pizzas that are individually assembled and prepared by hand for immediate consumption on the spot. Now, instead of reform heading in the direction of public health, we are seeing the commoditization of health care. i mean, people lie an misrepresent that stuff all the time. Isn’t importing good. You have just described a private justice system. not only do i not see the drug war as a benefit, i see it as a towering and needless harm. It also protects against rights violations by individuals seeking vigilante justice.”. I explain why your view is wrong, and you make another disparaging statement devoid of facts. Let’s start immediately with the USPS monopoly on 1st class delivery. This is especially true in advanced societies in which the opportunity cost of basic subsistence is fairly low, and killing someone else for their dinner may cost far more than it’s worth. Thankfully Trump is all over this issue. Hopefully, Ram and you will come up with some logic and objective, verifiable evidence to support that tariffs will benefit the US economy. Government, at all levels, has exceeded the scope of their authority. No it doesn’t. Many other species appear to defend their own individual sense of self determination just as humans do, but I doubt they think of that as having natural rights. My point is that the notion of natural rights is so elastic as to be virtually meaningless in political debate. If you get the benefit of what you are being taxed for, it’s okay. The idea that if I buy something from you, you must buy something from me is just silly. Jury duty is compulsory according to legislation. Asymmetric information. “My point is that, when people invoke natural rights they are stating their assumptions and values, not proving their conclusions.”. Undersupply of doctors generally and of doctors who will accept insurance specifically, along with overdemand stimulated by government-driven health-insurance coverage, leads to mass shortages. A commodity is a good or a service that is exchanged for money. What, do you think you’re being compassionate and caring by robbing some people you don’t even know to pay for medical care for other people you don’t even know? They are against any tariffs. Now, please explain why all your rights are granted by government. Sorry for bringing a divergence opinion from the stated topic. Did you really think that I was saying that the mere fact that people made the argument made it true? It is the same principle in whatever shape it develops itself. Margaret Flowers, M.D., is a Maryland pediatrician seeking the Green Party nomination for the US Senate. Health Care: Private Good vs. Public Good By SIEGFRIED G. KARSTEN* ABSTRACT. Yep, we can’t. The weaknesses of S 1804 prevent it from fully transforming our health care system to a public service. We all know that no two individuals are exactly the same, but we also know that individuals are the same type of thing: human beings. Mostly they are cheaper. Healthcare is not a commodity but a public good, and we want to see a strong commitment of government and IFIs alike to the implementation of the SDGs instead of pushing policies that deepen inequality and inequity. That is what adults do. You don’t think Jefferson meant that to be a first principle that needed no further explanation? “In addition I am forced to pay for services for others who can’t afford to pay for them – whether or not those people even want the service they can’t afford.”, “If you get the benefit of what you are being taxed for, it’s okay.”. “Rights are socially constructed. The Enlightenment occurred and individuals came to recognize their sovereignty. Markets are the solution in medical care, just as they are in virtually every other area. Taxation isn’t always *called* theft, because some folks don’t want to deal with the cognitive dissidence, of saying “It’s OK to rob me”, but the act of taking from others by force IS. they were not “made up” so much as “discovered” in the same way that the arch was and they are not arbitrary nor flexible if you want to build a durable structure. the state will, literally take no notice of you. And we need to force people in other countries to buy stuff from US companies, even though it costs more to buy from us than from companies in their own countries. It sucked, but it’s not the company’s obligation to provide me with a job. sorry for the divergence. As I noted, my comment was directed at the specific instance of paying for roads that you use. “those who are as different [from other men] as the soul from the body or man from beast—and they are in this state if their work is the use of the body, and if this is the best that can come from them—are slaves by nature. Jon Murphy asked, “It’s [the right to a trial by your peers] not related to life or liberty or property?”. If we had the above situation, people would surely revolt. And, as any good trial lawyer will tell you, you do not want jurors who feel coerced or really just don’t want to be there. That is nonsense. the way we do such a thing is to take the compulsion out. Movements for social transformation have always been told they are asking for too much. Because you don’t get elected if you don’t promise them? Would YOU allow someone to die in the street for lack of money to pay for care? We will import all services. “A commodity is any good or service (“products” or “activities”) produced by human labor and offered as a product for general sale on the market.” http://www.military.com/daily-news/2015/09/04/ig-report-300000-veterans-died-while-waiting-health-care-va.html, http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-195277/NHS-death-rates-times-higher-US.html, “They also suggest that long waiting lists mean diseases are more advanced before they are treated.”, “Also, take health spending as an investment.”. Those trying to justify American slavery knew they were wrong too. Let us do that in every field. Tariffs are not conservative values. Diagnosing a sore throat requires more training than it did when the service was paid for in chickens? How would you justify taking your neighbor’s money for any reason if he didn’t want to give it? In that case, why don’t we ship every damn service job including the poeple who comment here. Emergent orders of various types are all around us. “I do believe that both markets and nation states represent good examples of emergent order.”. According to these experts, it’s good to import some things, be it goods or services, so long as it’s comparatively advantageous to do so. Efforts to introduce universal health coverage in all countries will move healthcare closer towards being a public We can sit back and cheer, or we can use logic and facts to explain to the hayride driver that he should make a right turn instead of running into the economic ditch. I get calls regularly from clients who start the conversation with “you know that thing you told me not to do, well I did it, and now I am in trouble. Thank god for that. I’ve asked you this three times now, but I’ve not gotten an answer (I’ve asked other Trump supporters, and I’ve not gotten an answer from them either): Why do tariffs need to be on the table at all? They were actually keenly aware of how controversial these claims were. I want the legitimate functions of government such as national defense. It is a social construct designed to protect our life, liberty, and property from the abusive state. But see… that’s a problem. It didn’t with the “Hope and Change” crowd. that sounds like theft to me, although it’s probably one of the fairest forms of theft – if there is such a thing. Our opponents are those who profit from the current health care system, such as the pharmaceutical companies behind the opioid epidemic, those who are ideologically opposed to public safety nets, the commercial media, as Yves Smith describes, and legislators from both major parties, even those who claim to be progressive, because our political system is dominated by Wall Street. >—-“BTW thanks for reminding me why I no longer respond to Greg Webb. I happen to believe that there are no crimes against the state, but only crimes against people. (Note a toll device costs only $5 so if you live there it makes sense plus it works in the Orlando area as well.). It is a strong and growing sector. Period. A gas tax is theft. Some we may not be able to do like Hot food. You just don’t see other species respecting rights and forming either representative governments or your beloved bowling leagues. “Sometimes taxes are a necessary part of civilisation.”. societies are the same way. S 1804 is the Medicare for All Act in the Senate that was introduced on September 13 of this year by Senator Sanders with 16 co-sponsors, all Democrats. If you get the benefit of what you are being taxed for, it’s okay”. it’s sort of a finessing of the issue (in a very disingenuous and despicable fashion) but it may be true that some people honestly believed that africans were not people. My point is that, when people invoke natural rights they are stating their assumptions and values, not proving their conclusions. so courts can generate income and use it to attract and pay jurors. None of these things are to “opposed to US manufacturing”. Have you applied for the job? We have no right to coerce others. And they are never satisfied. Benthem viewed the collective as having sovereignty. We do have a choice. I wonder if there’s a connection? Winning the fight for a National Improved Medicare for All health care system is possible. That is why Franklin changed Jefferson’s original words from referencing God, for he know people regularly deny God, to self evident because he knew that no one but the disingenuous could deny rights that they would fight for if you tried to take them away from them. We have a “right” to be secure in our persons, houses, papers, and effects from unreasonable searches and seizures – by *government*. Derived demand cont. They were actually keenly aware of how controversial these claims were. the best way to to make taxes as user pays as possible. “The Aristotle’s argument is basically that those who may be enslaved are inferior. You want to contact NY legal firms which are outsourcing. Washington, DC 20036, Main telephone: 202.862.5800 As I’m sure you’re aware, jury trials developed as protection for ordinary citizens against the arbitrary tyranny of the king. Sure not every policy of his is perfect, but I’ll take the 75% on offer and the steal the rest later ! “… but we can’t have people dying on the streets because they had no money to see a doctor.”. Did any famous economists at GMU recommend it to you? "When I hear, healthcare is a right, what I hear is, 'healthcare will no longer have choices, we will provide it as a government commodity and you can wait in line.'" I know your views. Which means that you and others of us who have similar compassion for the poor, including medical providers, would see that those who needed it, but couldn’t afford medical care, would get it, right. I read his comments less and less but I am ambivalent about skipping them because that can mean missing some hilarious bits of unintended irony. Those of us who believe that “all men are created equal and are endowed by their creator” do not make such a distinction. I practice law for a living. It isn’t in itself a natural right. They were big on the “No taxation without representation” rallying cry.”. CTRL + SPACE for auto-complete. “A fair trial doesn’t just protect against rights violations by the state. I had almost forgotten. Health generally is not considered a public good, because non-paying individuals (for health insurance, healthy food, etc.) States, like the rest of the industrialized world, has defined health care as a common good. Choice. Why Health Care is not a Commodity When I tell this story to my students, many of them are fooled. With complexity, comes greater costs. Governments pretends to grant us various “rights”, which aren’t really rights at all, but merely promises by the state that it won’t interfere with our right to self ownership and self determination in certain areas of our lives. As medical student Mike Pappas describes, we need to look beyond access to care and recognize that: “We must address the social determinants of health. Imports and exports are good for an economy. can it claim a right to enslave a mother and force her to carry it against her will? “Sure not every policy of his is perfect”. (for the sake of discussion, let’s assume the tax pays for all road construction and maintenance). Do we have a choice? We have a “right” to free speech which only means the government won’t interfere with our freedom to speak. That’s what we learn from Ben Shapiro writing in National Review: The idea seems to be that unless you declare medical care a right rather than a commodity, you are soulless. No, I’m not aware of any species besides humans that establish representative governments. I choose not to pay for a federal department of education. Writers who claim to be progressives argued that those who want National Improved Medicare for All are asking for too much, that it is just not politically feasible and that we must compromise. To elaborate further, on the question of rights, we should consider whether there are any positive rights at all. In my opinion, no one has a right to something that must be provided by someone else. They associate public care with inferior service. Health Over Profit for Everyone (HOPE), a campaign of Popular Resistance, sent a letter to Sanders before he introduced his bill urging him not to compromise from the start. $5.00 The government (we the people) prosecute and a jury of your peers (we the people) decide. . Do you make your own soap? And, we can look at a white man and a black man and tell that they are the same type of thing. No. Donation Total: (take, say 1% of awards and mandated settlements – though there might be some moral hazard there). That does not make it a valid argument. Now with that the state could in principal charge you on a per mile basis, the mileage being collected on an annual basis during a auto inspection. No one claimed it was a natural right in and of itself. Dr. Adam Gaffney traces and explains this trend from the 1940s to the present in “The Neo-liberal Turn in American Health Care.”, Make no mistake, currently, in the United States, health care is a commodity, and the profiteers are going wild. This is how we did Medicare as a totally new system in 1965 before we had computers. There was no more a monolithic voice at that time than there is now. As I wrote, it is a privilege granted by the state. Health care as an economic commodity. ”. They are the two principles that have stood face to face from the beginning of time; and will ever continue to struggle. Yes they are. It is disingenuous for anyone to argue that “You work and toil and earn bread, and I’ll eat it.” And, it is disingenuous to make that argument whether you are Aristotle or Stephen Douglas or Greg Gossip. “When the founders said “We hold these truths to be self evident…” they weren’t literally claiming that they were self evident.”. If you judge someone guilty and punish them for an alleged crime without a fair trial then you are violating any meaningful understanding of their rights. But, you cannot hire a lawyer from India who knows the ins and outs of the courts, particularly in a speciality area like I practice. Your careless use of the word “investment”- a frequent habit of another person named Barry – has drained almost all meaning from the word. With just a week left before Congress’ budget reconciliation process ends, the Senate is once again peddling a poorly-thought out plan to repeal and replace the Affordable Care Act (ACA). Of course serving on a jury provides a golden opportunity to practice jury nullification. It has been introduced every session since 2003 and it has broad support from the single-payer health care movement. One way it does so is with the right to a trial by jury. This is foolhardy, both morally and practically. It has strong language protecting women’s reproductive rights and it removes most co-pays and deductibles. The state must take reasonable legislative and other measures, within its available resources, to achieve the progressive realization of each of these rights.” Yet the World Health Organization ranks South Africa somewhere near the bottom of the globe in terms of medical care. You’re aware, of course, that people can be charged with a crime by a group of people calling themselves “The Government”, whether or not anyone’s rights have been violated. Yeah I don’t know about this. i think you are flat out missing the issue. It is intended to protect people accused of crimes against the state from state tyranny by interposing other ordinary people between the state and the accused. In this case the assumptions about all men being created equal and having inalienable rights is that first principle. The daughter gets well …”. does it have rights? If you liked this article, please donate $5 to keep NationofChange online through November. You must be a “progressive” democrat for Trump. But the left believes that declaring necessities rights somehow overcomes the individual rights of others. Most interesting. I believe there aren’t, because they would require that someone be placed in our service to provide us with whatever we had a positive right to. Let me know when you come up with a valid argument against natural rights. Every official will be visiting every other nation and will welcome all imports. That means mostly former parts of the British Empire, and parts of Europe, including some former colonies of European countries. He earns $30 million a year (or ~$857,000 per game). The Sox could fire him and hire me at League minimum ($400,000 a year, or about $11,000 per game) for the same job,saving them $846,000 per game. Why do you believe YOU have some special insight into “what must be done”? Tariffs make countries poorer. Exactly. All of these things require scarce resources combined with labor (another scarce resource) to produce the final good. The US makes more with less employees. 1. ” I assure you, it is a lot easier to get out of jury duty than you seem to think.”. “Ok then. That’s correct. So, what’s the solution for poor people? The assumption we are making with the NHS bill is that healthcare is a commodity to be traded and patients are savvy, sceptical consumers. As usual, thanks for the laughs, Ron H. I just remembered that you went to a public school and never went to the university. but defining “human” is always a bit arbitrary. Does this mean a man does not have the right to a trial or a jury? I assure you, it is a lot easier to get out of jury duty than you seem to think. He’s put himself in a unique position to make change. They might change in future. Now, if we can get the US government out of the bailout business, then we will probably end up with smaller competitors taking over the bloated bureaucracies at GM, firing a bunch of “managers,” and actually begin making great American cars again. If not, why do you believe anyone else would? For many people duty was the preeminent value.”. What nonsense. you’re on your own. No doubt that’s so. “Why do tariffs need to be on the table at all?”. “In the olden days … sick daughter … doctor … chickens. Unless your answer is “Yes”, don’t look now- you’re an importer. The kid determines the quality of his or her education, not whether he or she went to public school. Technology and the internet have increased the (potential) productivity of instructors by orders of magnitude. The reality is that most of these guys here spout their hard line ideological positions to the nth degree knowing full well in the comfort of their tax-payer subsidised tenured academic positions that they are sheltered from the negative effects of trade. Thus, it should be abolished regardless of whether some want it and think it provides “benefits.”. . You’re welcome. give that to me or i shall do violence to you is theft. Nation states represent the “emergence” of the dominance of one group of people over another, generally larger group. doesn’t include being forced to pay for others. the phrase “religion of peace” springs to mind. Only three audience members agreed with the proposition that healthcare is a commodity. Commodity security exists when every person is able to obtain and use quality essential health supplies whenever he or she needs them. Perhaps one of the greatest concerns about S 1804 is the long transition period. And, everyone is willing to fight for them. Please explain how we can all voluntarily discriminate based on race through HOA agreements. do not endear conservative values to the public.”. it’s a tricky question. I understand that – always back the horse called “self interest” cause you know it’ll try the hardest. The question is: Who here is opposed to US manufacturing? I’ve not read it yet, although I do own it. You won’t be disappointed. You are making our point for us, although we meant the cost to consumers of products ‘made by hand”, not just the labor part. This will require changing medical education and medical practice.”. Do you mine and refine the ore you use in your factory to build the car you drive? To make a commodity cheaper and better, two elements are necessary: profit incentive and freedom of labor. If people wanted those things for which taxes are collected, they would pay for them voluntarily, and they wouldn’t be called taxes, and there would be no need for threats. Yet, despite the erosion of the public system, the contrast between these two facilities, the former fully private, the latter fully public, couldn't be greater. if it’s just a mass of 200 cells is it a person? Remember how you rejected the laws of supply and demand to argue that restricting the supply of buyers based on race would cause home prices to increase. Like when he told you he the had to get off of Facebook because other people were too argumentative. This includes understanding which proposals are insufficient too, such as the much-promoted public option and lowering the age of Medicare. “Personally, I think you guys are the lunatics.”. rights are not merely socially constructed. We should worry about both, not just one. Yes. America considers health care … Those are all great ideas, and I agree wholeheartedly. “if other nations screw their people, that’s sad for them. There are only so many doctors, hospitals, and, most important, money to go around. Oh yes and , I do, but most rights violations by individuals are pretty straight forward, while many rights violations by the state are considered legitimate. Pure hyperbole. He has turned Jon’s comment section into a wasteland where the overwhelming majority of the comments are Greg Webb in an excruciatingly predictable and insipid conversation with himself. It’s not related to life or liberty or property? It is. Until we in the United States decide to de-commodify our health care and health by implementing a universal, single, publicly financed, national health program such as Medicare for All, we will remain in our current state of ethical underdevelopment. Learning could be almost as cheap and easy as buying, renting, or streaming movies at home, but for government meddling. Democrats and Republicans in Congress are discussing a “bipartisan approach,” as outlined by the Center for American Progress, which is funded by health industry lobbyists, to fix the health care system. The opposite of a public good is a private good, which is both excludable and rivalrous.These goods can only be used by one person at a time–for example, a wedding ring. We provide the tools and information you need to accomplish this. Here’s the thing: It’s not the case that imports are good and exports are bad, it is the case that exports are the cost of imports, and the lower the cost the better. pay the FAA (which ought to be private anyhow) most taxes can be user pays if we conceive them properly. I suspect many people share that view. use a road or a bridge, pay a fee. You do make stuff up. I may recognize your necessity and offer charity; my friends and I may choose to band together and fund your medical care. Being forced to serve on a jury is one example. How do you reconcile your belief that the (federal) income tax is theft with your belief that some government services – national defense perhaps – require that people be forced to pay? But the bottom line in this fight is profit for a few, not health for the many, and so it is the public who suffers. Morally, you have no right to demand medical care of me. 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Natural law, or statutory law for American jurisprudence take, say 1 % of awards mandated...
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